So... I'm a snob. I know I'm hard as hell on my pants. I ride motorcycles in them and twice have gone over. Thing is, the same pair of Eddie Bauer jeans survived two lowsides, on the same side, in the same place. I would pay more for durable jeans, but the more you pay, the thrasheder they are already. I'm hard as hell on my t-shirts, too. I wear them and then wash them and then wear them again and just don't care in between. Since t-shirts are all I wear, getting new ones is no big. But permanent shit... I'm a big fan of Oberon Design. I just bought my wife one of these and you know what? It's the shizzle. It's made in USA, hand-crafted by a dude named Brendan and it'll last a thousand years. I have a kindle cover from Oberon that survived flying off the back of a KLR at 70mph... which the kindle did not. I sent the scuffed cover back to Oberon and they shined it up for me and sent it back. Another friend of mine handcrafts leather and canvas goods. And his shit is expensive, and his shit is metrosexual, but his shit is tight. You're not going to buy backpacks very often, so the ones you buy should be fuckin' awesome. Hell, even my watch is hand-made. When it breaks I send it down to Bjorn and he fixes it. I'd wax poetic about my motorcycle jacket (a Hein Gericke Dakar) but they haven't made them since 2005. I'll still be riding in it 30 years from now. How do I know? It's a lot like my Schott, which I've been wearing since 1992, which is a lot like my dad's Schott, which he wore from 1958 until 1991 when somebody stole it. People say "couture" and mean "expensive hand-made shit that's oh-so-very-fashionable." I'm not into couture, but I sure am into wearing things by people I've met, can talk to on the phone, and stand behind their products. I have a friend who used to design for Skechers. Their shit was designed to come apart within three months so you'd have to buy more Sketchers. I've got a pair of DCs right now that are a year old and shredding... but that's okay because I only wear them when I'm riding my longboard and the left toe has been scraped off on every hill within a mile of here. My Carolina 118s? Already resoled once, due for another, replaced the old pair of 118s after three soles and 20 years of service. If I wore hoodies I'd buy this thing.
jesus christ, i could buy a couple dozen decent equivalents for the price of any one of those. bougie as fuck. i mean, i could see myself buying the hoodie in OP, but this is on another level. even most cheap products will last me longer than i enjoy them. maybe if i expected to never see a store again, it would make sense to buy a three or four hundred dollar bag. but i don't plan on trekking into the wilderness to live there and capitalism doesn't look like it will end tomorrow so i don't see how anyone could justify that unless they are just drowning in cash.
You couldn't though. Handcrafted counts. Thoughtful design counts. Ease of use counts. Durability counts. I had to look up "bougie." It appears to be what people with little cultural understanding would call "bourgeois" if only they could spell it. So I ask you, ye who pretends to the proletariat: which is better - a $50 bag that you hate that you buy eight times, or a $400 bag that you love that you buy once? I can tell you which one doesn't go to the landfill seven times. I can also tell you which one isn't made in a sweatshop for thirteen cents an hour. I can tell you which one provides jobs for people in your neighborhood who speak your language and which one is crafted by people who like to craft things. If that's bourgeois, sign me up. And go make me a latte while you're at it, prole.
I wondered if "bougie" would offend you, and I'm kind of disappointed to see that it does. Anyway, I'm sure your bag is nice and you enjoy it, but $400 could pay rent, or months of transport. Dropping that much on a mere container, no matter how well-crafted, is absolutely absurd. Being able to even consider things like landfills, sweatshops, or whatever beyond pure functionality at the point of purchase is a luxury. It's not a matter of cost-over-time, because even cheap shit will last long if you know how to fix it. I still have the "expensive" $30 backpack that my mom was reluctant to buy me when I was in elementary school in the 90s, and it's a little worn out; I've had to replace bits like the zipper pulls and the plastic buckles, but it's still mostly serviceable. It still holds junk inside of it. I've got a couple other bags that I use most of the time, but I didn't spend any money on them because you can literally pick these things up off the ground with an eye for salvage and a bit of luck. Go ahead, enjoy your luxuries. But don't act like it's even in the realm of possibility for the rest of us, because that just makes you look out of touch. And the last bit... it isn't insulting to me, it's insulting to yourself. You're pretty thoughtful most of the time but you have some terrible blind spots.If that's bourgeois, sign me up. And go make me a latte while you're at it, prole.
Let me start out by saying, eat shit, you self-righteous little hipster douchebag. There, now we're no longer speaking in code. Let me continue to point out that "bougie" is a word designed to be offensive. There are no positive connotations whatsoever. It is something people who want something call people who have something. There's more than a shade of sour grapes to it as well - someone has something more than me, therefore they must be culturally and intellectually bereft. I, on the other hand, am pure of heart and mind and do not spring for absurd luxuries like $400 bags. Therefore you can be disappointed that I find a patently offensive word offensive, but let's be clear about one thing: someone who calls someone else "faggot" is trying to offend them. Someone who calls someone else "douchebag" is trying to offend them. Someone who calls someone else "hipster" is trying to offend them. If I weren't offended by it I'd be autistic. If you're surprised that I am, maybe the autistic one is you. I will add that never once did I tell you to buy a $400 bag. Never once did I insist that everyone have one. Never once did I insinuate that there is not a time and place for cheap things - I even pointed out that I buy cheap jeans and t-shirts. Yet you decided to come in and shit all over me for the choices I have made for myself. That's a dick move in any language, in any era, in any social circle. There is no way to place your statements in any but a denigrating, condescending, antagonistic context and fuck you, buddy. We can play all nicey-nicey and be friends or you can step up and I will tear you the fuck apart. You wanna take this negative I will drag it to depths you have not witnessed in your young life. You are outgunned, outclassed, out-educated, out-experienced and wholly out of your depth. The above was me bitch-slapping you for being a dick but if you wanna double down out of some self-righteous sense of self derived from your need to defend The Gap I'm right here to ruin your fucking weekend. Finally, I don't know what fucking planet you're on but I was paying $500 a month in rural Washington to live with six roommates in 1995. My insurance was $350 a month back when I was your age. I bought a $200 backpack to go hiking with back when I was seventeen and making $6 an hour and I got a screamin' deal... and that was back when Reagan was president. I used that backpack when I went hiking (and, for six years, whenever I flew - it was the only luggage I had). So $400 for a bag? Get a grip, junior. Shit costs money in the world. I've got a $200 backpack for my motorcycle. I've got a $90 tank bag. And yeah - I bought my wife a $400 satchel for her laptop and medical charts and you know what? She uses it every goddamn day. So when you imply that spending $400 on a bag puts me "out of touch" I hope you realize how completely out to lunch you are. I dated a girl back in the '90s with a wallet that cost more than that. Now - go play your $400 XBOX360 or your $300 PS3 with your $70 Grand Theft Auto on your $300 flatscreen while surfing the web on your $800 laptop and get the fuck off my lawn. Median rent where I live is over $1400 a month and I'm all out of time to spend on some fuckwit who lives with his mom who thinks I'm out of touch.
First of all, calm down. Yes, I know it's an offensive word to some people, but I wanted to see how you'd react. Now I know. Second of all, How did you write that without getting whiplash? Anyway, you seem pretty intent on mud wrestling, so I'm out. I fear we have nothing to say to each other. You can keep speculating about my life and what I might spend money on if you want to.So when you imply that spending $400 on a bag puts me "out of touch" I hope you realize how completely out to lunch you are. I dated a girl back in the '90s with a wallet that cost more than that.
That's a cool way to be able to consume. I'm curious though, how/why did you begin buying like that? Edit: by the way, those backpacks look awesome.I'm not into couture, but I sure am into wearing things by people I've met, can talk to on the phone, and stand behind their products.
It probably started with the watch. I saw an ad for it in the back of American Cinematographer, picked one up off eBay for next to nothing, and discovered that the "manufacturer" was annoyed that I bought used. Then I needed it fixed so I drove down to San Diego (my sister lives there) and discovered that the "manufacturer" was this cool Norwegian guy working out of his garage. Then I did some copy editing for him and do product placement wherever I can for him. His watches are truly dope. I had a conversation with Cee-Lo Green about watches once. He was way into mine, despite the fact that it cost $450 and despite the fact that he was wearing a fuckin' Arctica. That's the sort of thing you get when you buy quality hand-made.
I'm not a cinematographer, I have no need for a watch that lets me know what the lighting is like. But, I am interested in getting a new watch. While I love the look of some of the watches like the Date Just II 41mm steel, I'll be damned if I'm going to spend $9000 on a watch. I would love to support an independent watch maker. Anyone have any suggestions?
I'm not a cinematographer either. However, I LOVE knowing sunrise and sunset, moonrise and moonset. The fact that the Yes is a 24-hour dial really changes your perception of things. Read more here and here. Join me and Adam Savage. Barring that, go Pebble. They're amusing.
Love the Yes. I like being able to switch off the digital display and go only by the 24 hour hand. I managed to kill mine by freediving a shade too deep and bleeding saltwater into the digital mechanism. Bjorn told me to send it over and he'd take a look at it, despite my being on a different continent. Great customer service. Fingers crossed.
I bought this hoodie by Flint&Tinder not long ago. It's still in pre-production and I haven't received it yet so we'll see how good it actually is. It's pretty much the same concept: 100% Made in America and guaranteed to last at least 10 years. It's the fist time I buy a hoodie for that price, so we'll see if I buy into this quality over quantity lifestyle.
It's a great story, -I almost bought one earlier this year. But the problem is that I'm just too aware of brands, their stories, and their media kits. I really only have one question. Will this thing actually last long enough for me to pass on to my kid with regular use? If so, 80 bucks is a really good price. If not, then meh. Made here in non-sweatshop conditions is a good selling point though, -I'd pay a bit more for that nowadays. More to support good labor conditions than silly nationalistic reasons. They're kind of tapping into the whole BIFL angle.
BIFL? I'm not familiar with the term, would you mind expanding? Oh, no doubt it's part of their marketing thing to make people feel good about their purchase. I was kind of hoping that someone on hubski had bought one or knew what the deal is on these. I'd much prefer to buy quality garments, if the option is available and I have the money to.It's a great story, -I almost bought one earlier this year. But the problem is that I'm just too aware of brands, their stories, and their media kits.
BIFL = Buy it for life. Basically it's a type of consumerism that emphasizes purchasing items that provide the best value over a "lifetime". They pay more for items that utilize high quality materials and construction with the understanding that they will pay less in the long run by not having to replace or spend as much repairing. They tend to value craftsmanship, and BIFLers love a good story.
$80 for a hoodie?! I bought the one I wear semi-daily at Old Navy for two fucking dollars. Two dollars. It's awesome, tight-fitting; think skinny grunge. And it cost less than the milkshake I stupidly got last night. I mean come on. Shit like this makes me wonder if all the people who complain about never having any money are actually worth listening to. Hoodies are $50 at Gap? But Gap is the store marketed at parents with a lot of kids who need cheap, durable clothes... I'm so confused, but I'm like that more and more these days so whatever.
Completely an aside, there is a chocolate/coffee shop near me. This summer I noticed while getting an espresso that they had shakes and malts, so I told the girl to just make me a shake and dump a couple shots of espresso right in. HOLY SHIT. This summer I probably had, no exaggeration, close to 100 vanilla espresso shakes. Sort of glad Fall is here so I can calm down.And it cost less than the milkshake I stupidly got last night.
You are now aware of what Espresso Affogato means.
I had that in NY this past summer from a little roadside cart, -the ice cream version. I should have known everything has a name. It basically kicks the ass of every flavor combination that companies like Ben & Jerry's or Haagen Daz could ever come up with. A pinnacle.
Okay so what happened to me was that I live near a place that had half-off milkshakes all summer, and I got conditioned in August and September, and now it's not summer and they're not half-off -- but I'm fucking addicted so I still order them if I have an especially shitty day. They don't do espresso otherwise I would definitely try that.
Shit like this? Man, these are clearly not marketed at people who really don't have money. Many people complain about not having money for many reasons. I suspect that you're not actually talking about impoverished people who are complaining about not having money (or I hope not). Old Navy, Gap and Banana Republic are all owned by the same parent company and do business on a scale several orders of magnitude larger than the business this dude's company does. Not only that, but a lot of Old Navy's stuff is made in other countries for next to nothing and their orders are gigantic, so in order to get Old Navy's very valuable repeat business the cost per unit goes down. Not to mention that the article clearly states that the quality of the materials are much higher and harder to work with than the one you bought at Old Navy, which uses blends. All signs point to this being the kind of product that people with money who don't want to dress like they have money, want to buy. Not only that, but it's designed to be a high-quality product, whereas Old Navy's clothes are not created with that in mind. The fact that it's the lowest rung of that company's product ladder should also be noted. Basically, you can't compare the price of Old Navy vs. this company, since they're operating at vastly different levels of output and for different purposes. Also, this company makes sweatshirts. That's it. If their sweatshirts don't sell, they're fucked. If Old Navy's don't sell, well, something else in their catalog will likely cover that loss. Thus, their strategy is much different than Old Navy's strategy and their target demographics are different too. Old Navy is marketed toward teenagers and young adults, who will likely move up to Gap and eventually Banana Republic. So, basically you've compared a hamburger to a steak, because they're both beef. That may be, but people who have a taste for steak and the money to buy it are going to buy steak when it suits them, though overall they might still eat more hamburgers. Yeah, there are people who might choose to exclusively eat steak, but most of the people who will do that will be able to afford it.Shit like this makes me wonder if all the people who complain about never having any money are actually worth listening to.
People who think they don't have money but actually have tons of money compared to a lot of the truly poor. People who bother to get clothes Gap or BR instead of just Goodwill, Walmart, etc. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it seems to be the same demographic that claims it's being screwed by the economy. It's not one of my better generalizations, but I stand by it. Actually, my entire post was a reaction to the apparent price of a piece of clothing at Gap. While this site you linked to certainly isn't marketed at anyone below upper-middle class, Gap is. So is Old Navy. Maybe, when comparing American Giant to Gap or Old Navy, which I didn't intend to do. But when I'm comparing a $50 hoodie at one of those stores to an extremely cheap hoodie at another ... that's apples to apples. PS: I should say that I completely understand how my post could be misconstrued because the entire article is about this online store and I was essentially ranting about one sentence.Shit like this? Man, these are clearly not marketed at people who really don't have money. Many people complain about not having money for many reasons. I suspect that you're not actually talking about impoverished people who are complaining about not having money (or I hope not).
So, basically you've compared a hamburger to a steak, because they're both beef. That may be, but people who have a taste for steak and the money to buy it are going to buy steak when it suits them, though overall they might still eat more hamburgers. Yeah, there are people who might choose to exclusively eat steak, but most of the people who will do that will be able to afford it.
That's fair. I do understand where you're coming from, but I really hope that American Giant will encourage similar companies to emerge. Personally, I'd prefer to save money to purchase a quality garment than to continue to buy several cheaper, lower quality garments. However, given my finances, I have bought from Old Navy fairly recently as the prices are what I can afford. I hear what you're saying about shopping at Goodwill and Walmart, but time is a cost as well, especially at Goodwill. Personally, I think that might just be the people you're interacting with. I'm not exactly sure what demographic you're talking about specifically, but I will say that I do feel a bit screwed by the economy at the moment, given my skills and experience. I think that a lot of people are right in thinking that. I also think that perhaps you're talking about two sets of people that happens to have some overlap, but whatever, there's bound to be some.I should say that I completely understand how my post could be misconstrued because the entire article is about this online store and I was essentially ranting about one sentence.
People who think they don't have money but actually have tons of money compared to a lot of the truly poor. People who bother to get clothes Gap or BR instead of just Goodwill, Walmart, etc. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it seems to be the same demographic that claims it's being screwed by the economy.
Yeah, I get you. It's more of an, if you're screwed by the economy, shop within your means thing. Don't complain if you get screwed because you fail to adjust. The vast majority of us are also getting screwed. But you're right it's two different groups and only when there's overlap does it bother me.
Not that this is an argument for or against the sweatshirt, but (just to add a little fuel to your fire) it's actually $90. This article was published a year ago. It makes one wonder if they have raised the price because they're selling so well, or if they can't produce them at $80.
My original post is sort of misleading, I wasn't really talking about the made in America product that humanodon posted -- that's marketed upscale, and I understand that, and have no problem with it. Wouldn't and couldn't buy it, but whatever. I was incensed, however, about the Gap hoodie that's apparently fifty bucks, because Gap markets to lower middle class in my opinion, and probably fools a good number of them into thinking that they're the most economical option. That's terrible.
I wonder how much that sweatshirt from Ol' Mavy cost Ol' Mavy to produce? I wonder how much they paid the persons involved in making it? Do you think they get health care? Do you think they get education? Do you think America's foreign policy has affected the lives of these people? America is a consumerist/materialist society. So our progress of getting cheap clothes is not just because robots. It costs child labor. It costs dangerous working. It cost creating economic instability and large "loans" for political and corruptible leverage. It costs inequity on such a grand scale that it truly puts all of us into the one percentile in comparison. But please ... keep wolfing dog the bread and laughing at the circus.
I generally expect better comments than this in my inbox on hubski. You can attack me personally for free-market capitalism all you want, but I'm not ever going to respond on any meaningful level, because it dignifies your post. One question -- would you be less quasi-disgusted with me if I had bought the shiny, marketed $50 dollar hoodie that wasn't on clearance?