So I've been going through the process of cleansing the chakras. Whether you believe in such things or not, it's definitely a process to lay all the things before you that cause you fear, distress, shame, etc. and overcome them. I've even been drinking onion and banana juice (an old Indian guru concoction) to help with the cleanse. Regardless of it the juice helps, it actually tastes pretty nice.
So I was working today on the second chakra which is blocked by shame and guilt. I won't get into the nitty gritty of it all, but I've really done some nasty stuff that has hurt a lot of people, including those nearest to me. Keeping secrets in for so long has made the forgiveness of myself a laborious task. To open up this chakra and let the energy pass, one must forgive themselves in order to alleviate the pain/guilt.
But what does it really mean to forgive? I've never had to forgive anyone else so I'm not familiar with that experience. How does it effect your relationship with that person. If you've ever had to forgive yourself, how does that change your relationship with yourself?
Thank you in advance. Peace.
Just to be clear, you are talking about forgiving yourself for past behaviour, not forgiving others for wrongs done to you. You ask some good questions B_C and it's nice to see you in this space again. It reminds me a little of Step 9 of AA's 12-step program that involves making amends to others and understanding that making amends is not exactly the same as asking for forgiveness. It's also about showing intention to do no further wrong. (Mind you, I'm not an AA expert. There's lots to learn from AA programs and writings on line, and they offer some answers to your question: "What does it mean to forgive?") You say If those people still love you, perhaps they are waiting to hear from you. It seems to me that it would be hard to sincerely forgive yourself without first acknowledging to the other people an awareness of the pain you caused them and a realization that they may no longer trust you. Your hope is that they will one day see that you have changed direction and are worthy of their love and trust. What does it really mean to forgive yourself? I'm not sure we ever really can or should totally forgive ourselves. But I think we can and should acknowledge wrongs done and take a new path. Edit: We forgive ourselves by realizing that when the wrongs were done, we were the person we were. We had the needs, the pain, the awareness that we had. Now we are addressing our past deficits. We may not totally forgive ourselves, but we accept our past self, a self reacting to everything we faced; and move towards our reconstructed self, a self that considers choices before reacting. I'm not sure if that is as clear as I'd like it to be. May edit again. Sentence yourself to some kind of community service as a way of showing the sincerity of your new path. It depends on what one's current relationship is with one's self. What is it like now? Do you give yourself a LOT of leeway? Do you make a million excuses for yourself? Would you trust you?but I've really done some nasty stuff that has hurt a lot of people, including those nearest to me.
and now you want to forgive yourself and unblock those chakras.How does that change your relationship with yourself?
You make some really great points, as always. I'm under the impression that forgiving oneself would be similar to forgiving another, but I could be wrong. I sort of answered your question of would I trust myself in the previous paragraph, but I'll answer it more explicitly. Maybe. So long as I feel the guilt of what I've done, yes. But living with that isn't worth it, and I'm coming to realize that. But in light of the previous paragraph, yes. I trust myself. I know I will not do repeat those actions. Positive thinking. Thoughts create reality. My fiance recommened the book The Untethered Soul and it has done wonders helping me realize how to move forward. It's not your average self-help book. It really is enlightening.If those people still love you, perhaps they are waiting to hear from you.
Those who I love most have already forgiven me, which is the strange part. They've forgiven me but I have yet to do so for myself. It's also about showing intention to do no further wrong.
This is a tough one. I've been using the guilt as my defense against doing further wrong. Sometimes I feel as if that's what's preventing me from repeating my actions. Although, I have been getting to the root of the issue and working on healing that part of myself. But it almost feels like I'd be jumping off of a cliff if I were to be in that situation again and had forgiven myself. But maybe that's where it is. To be certain I would make wise decisions regardless. To be so utterly confident that it wouldn't happen again. Hmm...that may have been an internal revelation.
B_C -This above quote raises questions as does this one: We forgive others so that we are not personally weighed down with resentment for their past behaviour. We forgive others because sometimes we can see the bigger context of their behaviour and perhaps see that we too had some part in it. We forgive others because we love them and want to continue a renewed relationship with them -- we forgive them, but we are a little more cautious in our dealings with them. We learn to protect ourselves. So yes, forgiving others is different. How do we forgive ourselves? (and I too have done foolish bad things, so:) By "community service" - what I actually mean is doing more good than bad, actively going beyond the comfortable to help others, making amends perhaps indirectly. Daily. Consciously moving in the direction of goodness. What's done cannot be undone, as Lady MacBeth says. Sadly, there's no liquid paper for bad behaviour. Unblock those chakras with good deeds. Does that make any sense? I'll check out that book.I'm under the impression that forgiving oneself would be similar to forgiving another, but I could be wrong.
Those who I love most have already forgiven me, which is the strange part. They've forgiven me but I have yet to do so for myself.
I think forgiving others is very different from forgiving ourselves.
lil is wise, and gives sage council. Personally I have struggled with self-hate for a long time. Then I was upset at myself for hating myself. When I started being mindful, and when I started accepting, just a little bit, that I might actually be allowed to be loved, I started to forgive myself. It didn't happen quick, and I still have to work on being forgiving, but it is possible. Now, when I make a mistake, forget an assignment for school, burn some food, spend too much money, etc. My first response isn't 'You idiot, how could you be so stupid!' or 'Greedy, weak willed bastard, how could you do that?' Well, it is sometimes, but less of the time than it used to. My first, and healthier response is instead 'You are just as human as anyone else. You are allowed to make mistakes. You wouldn't judge a loved one so harshly as you judge yourself, so why would you judge yourself that way?' and in recognizing that, also recognize that if there is a way to make right what was wrong, to do it, and happily. The reason that I judged (And still judge) myself more harshly than I judged the mistakes of others, because I did not have the same love for myself that I did for others. I also hold myself to a higher standard than I hold others, but that's a separate issue.
Very powerful words. Thank you. I can relate strongly to everything you said. One of the things I've been working on is loving myself as I do others. I realized one day that if I truly believe everyone deserves to be loved unconditionally, why would I exclude myself from the "everyone" umbrella? I do, just as much as everyone, deserve to be loved. It's the allowing myself to feel that that seems to be taking time. But, all things in due time. Why, if you don't mind my asking, do you hold yourself to a higher standard and what is the benefit of doing so?
It does take time. But it gets easier. I can do it on my own, but my counselor and my girlfriend help significantly. I'm sure, as narcissistic as it is, that I will love myself more once I'm graduated from school (Which I still think is just to get a piece of paper saying that I'm a grown up) and have a job that will allow me to survive my heart disease independent of my parents. I don't mind sharing. I'd direct you first to this post. Essentially, I was raised as a 'gifted' child, and a religious one at that. I came to believe that my slightly above average intelligence, empathy, etc, were a direct command to BE better than my peers, BE the stronger person, take that which others can't, bear the unbearable so that 'weaker' people don't break. I'm smarter, so I should push myself to achieve academically like others simply can't even in their greatest effort. I'm more empathetic and kind so I should be more moral, more generous (Especially when giving of myself). My heart condition precluded me from athletics, so clearly my lifes work would be of the mind, of the human condition. In a moment of blinding clarity I realized that when I was very young I accepted that it was an abnormal condition for me to be content or happy. If I am content, then there is something else I should be doing. If I am happy, or satiated, someone else is going without.It's the allowing myself to feel that that seems to be taking time. But, all things in due time.
Isn't waiting for school to be over just another condition? Won't there be something else afterwards? Why not start loving yourself now, no matter the situation?
I was in a similar position as you as I just graduated in June. Once I learned how much debt I was in, I hated myself for deciding to get that piece of paper. I have, for the most part forgiven myself for that. I've learned that there really are advantages to that piece of paper, whether it should be so or not. Hmm, that's interesting for you to have that realization. I think it might be healthy to at least allow yourself some happiness. Yes, being content while others are starving may not be the best, but realizing how nice our current situation in this country is should allow some happiness.
Most likely. Work in progress my friend. Some days are easier than others. I have note on the desktop of my computer that has a running tally of my student debt on it. Again, working on it. Me being happy does not increase someone elses suffering. I have to repeat that to myself. When I am happy I try not to acknowledge it, because it will flee just as quickly. Mostly that last bit just makes me feel guilty. By a cosmic roll of the dice I was born in a place with medicine advanced enough to allow me to survive. By the roll of the same dice, hundreds of kids under 6 years old will die, burned to death in a sewer pipe by police officers in Bogota.Isn't waiting for school to be over just another condition? Won't there be something else afterwards?
Why not start loving yourself now, no matter the situation?
Once I learned how much debt I was in, I hated myself for deciding to get that piece of paper.
Hmm, that's interesting for you to have that realization. I think it might be healthy to at least allow yourself some happiness. Yes, being content while others are starving may not be the best, but realizing how nice our current situation in this country is should allow some happiness.
I definitely am. I appreciate the song. For future reference, I am an ex-christian, and will be anti-christian for quite some time. This isn't an attack on you by any means, but the bible gives me no satisfaction. My faith, when I had it, gave me no comfort and was a source of a lot of stress and anxiety.
Maybe it has to do with the fact that the past is the past, and it cannot be changed? So to forgive (either yourself or others) is to let go and gain freedom from something that is impossible to cure? When we fail to forgive ourselves we dwell on things instead of moving forward with a more dharmic attitude. No sense in feeling guilty, just don't do it again, and move on. When we fail to forgive others we dwell on something which again is from the past, and it stops us from moving on while focusing on opening our heart to the world. We live in an age of conditions. We need to learn how to live a life unconditionally.
As I've been going through the process of forgiveness, I have noticed that more frequently I am present of the Self at the seat of consciousness within. Thank you.
I've actually been mulling this over myself. It's weird, I can't seem to narrow any experience down to something black and white. A dictionary definition puts it down to pardoning an offence, and even to give up all claim on account of; remit (a debt, obligation, etc.) I like that second one. I like the idea that if I need to forgive another person for something they've done to me, forgiveness itself is the act of me taking away my claim to holding that offence to them. Taking away my (perceived) right to hold them un-forgiveness -- and basically releasing them from that, so that in the end you're back to being equal. I hope that makes sense. I suppose forgiving yourself is practically the same thing, releasing yourself from the thing you hold yourself in un-forgiveness of. Thanks for bringing this up, OP :)
Thanks for the thoughtful response. I like that. Especially releasing yourself from the thing you hold yourself in un-forgiveness of.
While it's easier said that done, anything is possible. Thank you.
What does it mean to forgive? I don't think I personally know what it really means to forgive. I have become expert in remembering how I have been treated by others, and while I rarely, rarely respond in kind, it most definitely informs our further interactions. I am an elephant in that way, and while it has served me well in life, I know that there are many times in which those deserving forgiveness have received cold treatment. That's my hairshirt, i suppose. I do, however, know a good place to start when thinking about forgiveness - Or rather, a good person to start with when thinking about forgiveness: Hector Black. Hector Black is an organic farmer who lives outside of Nashville, Tennessee. He served in the army during World War II and graduated from Harvard in 1949. He adopted Patricia Ann Knuckles while living in Atlanta, working in the civil rights movement. Patricia was murdered, then sexually assaulted by a home intruder who was stealing electronics/etc for drugs. The recordings below are an exposition of his journey to the forgiveness of Ivan Simpson, the man who killed his daughter. There used to be a great "The Moth" Podcast, where I felt he explained his story best, but it seems to be unobtainium and I can't find it. In its stead: RadioLab with Hector Black - http://www.radiolab.org/story/317629-dear-hector/ StoryCorps - Hector Black - http://storycorps.org/listen/hector-black/# A link to the victim impact statement he wrote for the trial, and his notes after the trial: http://www.prisonerlife.com/articles/articleID=26.cfm I am not a religious person. I would not go so far as to say i am anti-theist, but I have many significant problems with organized religion in most of its forms. That said, I admire the Quakers (of which Hector Black is one) and the Amish (who famously forgave the murderer of their children ) in their strict adherence to the forgiveness they find in their holy book. It is a difficult thing, and one that deserves significant credit. I hope you find the kind of forgiveness that Hector Black holds in his heart.
I play upright and in high school I performed that piece for a recital. Thank you for the links. I'll check them out and get back to you once I've had time to think about them.