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comment by thenewgreen
thenewgreen  ·  4862 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Jeff Tweedy: People Talking During Concert
I used to be a bartender/wait tables and it made me realize that everybody should have to do so for at least once in their life. It fosters empathy for all service industries. I was eating in a cafe with my wife the other day and a woman several tables over was loudly talking on her cell phone. The guy at the table next to her staired at her shaking his head with his fingers in his ears. -Was he right to be annoyed? Absolutely. Could he have communicated this more effectively? Absolutely. My point is that the "politeness" that you see as an increasing void in society exists on both sides of a situation. These days not only is the loud cellphone lady rude but the guy next to her is too. "Pardon me miss, would you mind either not speaking on your cell phone so loudly or perhaps just not speaking on it al all"? -This would be a better response.

My wife is one of the people in the crowd that would say nothing. When a situation like this arises, she immediately looks at me and says "don't say anything". Why shouldn't I? I know half the cafe is thinking the same thing. People are too passive. Being assertive is the only way to be. At least 3 times in my life I have had to step out of a movie theater to tell mgmt that the sound was off. If I didn't, I swear people would have just watched an entire movie in silence!

Anyways, I gave you a shout out in my description of this post. Thought it as kind of funny. http://hubski.com/pub?id=3261





alpha0  ·  4861 days ago  ·  link  ·  
"a better response".

You must be kidding me. I had one person flash me an exacto knife in subway when asked to please move over so I could take an (available) seat.

Social norms are only effective in context of social consensus (or enforcement). Let's face it: we live in a rude and selfish society these days. A polite request only computes in a polite society. The person making the polite inquiry expects social support. So if that guy instead of shaking his head had politely asked the sociopath in question to "would you please lower your voice?", it would not be a surprise that he would then be subjected to a rude, loud, and personal attack by the said sociopath with little expectation of social support from other patrons. (Unless cgod is in the room, in which case ... ;P)

One ex: Just try walking in a straight line on sidewalks in NYC. Impossible. I used to be able to walk from WallStreet to MorningSide without bumping into a single person, and we were all zipping. These days can't traverse a lousy block without having to do slalom around sidewalk hogers. (And it is not merely the tourist or the "unwashed" -- in fact, this pattern now includes the "educated" class as well. I swear they are all still mentally and socially walking up and down the high school corridors.)

thenewgreen  ·  4861 days ago  ·  link  ·  
They are all still mentally walking up and down the high school corridors -So true. As for the guy in the cafe asking the "sociopath" to lower her voice, he would have had support. That is what my "movie theater" analogy was meant to convey. We are all thinking it, it just takes someone to actually DO it. You are likely right that the woman on the phone would have not responded well, but sometimes.... once in a blue-moon people surprise you when you approach a potential conflict with some well intentioned civility. And this rare occurrence is what makes the effort still worth while. IMO.
thenewgreen  ·  4861 days ago  ·  link  ·  
It's worth noting that I'm NOT in NYC but rather Raleigh-Durham NC and the "control group" I'm working with in this experiment may be slightly different than yours.
alpha0  ·  4861 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Just give it time ...