You have made no arguments to this effect. We're here arguing in a thread about the 700 bands who have decided to make Harry Potter music. Again, you are denying the gradient: GTA didn't cause kids to go on a murder spree therefore pop culture is utterly without influence on children. "“Momma! There’s a black lady on television and she ain’t no maid!“ What's interesting to me is that you're arguing against introspection: "You're doing literary criticism that 94% of the population isn't. " One need not be conscious of the symbolism in order for it to have an effect; exactly the opposite in fact. Being consciously aware of something allows one to consider it and embrace it or disarm it as one chooses. being unaware of the symbolism simply gives you a pattern. And patterns matter. Take your student council example. What would have happened if your fellow students stuck up for you? What would have happened if they collectively walked out? What would have happened if they made themselves ungovernable? My sister's boyfriend didn't want to take his chemistry midterm so he called in bomb threats every day for three weeks. The administration decided we'd make those days up by staying until 5 every day. And at 3, we all got up and walked out. Now - had I gotten up and walked out all by myself, it would have been detention. But everyone? The administration made the prudent choice that the discipline was overshadowing the education and dropped it. In 7th grade there was a beloved teacher who was being let go. 50 students walked 8 miles to the administration (including across a gas pipeline over a canyon that's closed to foot traffic) to demand a reconsideration. They still let the teacher go... but one kid on that pipeline would have been arrested. 50 kids? It made the paper. More than that, it taught the administration not to fuck with us. You tried to run for president of the student council. Me? I declared myself the antichrist. Put handbills up all over the school. When the vice principal sent a minion to summon me to his office, I told the minion that if he had a problem with my freedom of expression he needed to come see me. In the end, the only rule he could get me on was failure to seek pre-approval of a "religious organization" so I had to take them all down. I taped one on my back and added a legal defense fund line and made $28. Because by that point, they'd been trying to stick it to us at least once a year for five years. And they knew that we weren't going to take it. We. The collective. As a group. You want to pin this on parents as if somehow parents decided to fuck up childhood. As if they wanted to encourage a culture of acquiescence. As if they wanted to make sure that kids were perpetually under the thumb. As if their kids' heroes should only display token resistance and always do whatever grownups tell them to do. Red Dawn came out when I was in 6th grade. The Bachman Books were published when I was in 5th. I graduated from a parking lot full of loaded gun racks; Columbine changed the world forever when I was a junior in college. Adults weren't really afraid of kids until then. But they are now. And a nice, cozy hero story in which the anointed, predestined aristocracy restores order through patience and obedience definitely aligns with the goals. The difference between my story and your story is Harry Potter. Not Harry Potter exclusively, but a culture that has identified Harry Potter as a "punk rock" rebel rather than a passive simp who lets his stepbrother beat him up on the reg despite being the most bitchin' wizard kid in the history of Hogwart's. Ask yourself: would Encyclopedia Fucking Brown put up with Dudley Dursley? The authoritarian paradigm is you do what your wicked stepsisters tell you to do until your fairy godmother swoops in to punish their cruelty as a deus ex machina and whisk you to the aristocracy. That's the kind of tale you tell when you want the peasants to be comfortable with their lot. The 20th century, however, was full of Tom Sawyers and Pippi Longstockings. Katniss Everdeen wouldn't put up with Delores Umbridge. Neither would Tris Prior. And I think that's a good thing.Part 1 is correct and Part 2 is incorrect.
Part 2 is wrong not because Harry Potter doesn't have authoritarian themes but because no kids are reading or watching those films and getting the takeaway that "authority is cool" and applying it to their personal lives. You're reading too much into it. You're doing literary criticism that 94% of the population isn't.
The problem is always the extent. At no point have I denied any gradient. My argument is "Harry potter can't possibly be that big of an influence on society, even if what you're saying is correct." I'm not arguing against introspection and you know this. It's the weighting of parameters. It's when you focus too narrowly on one thing and you miss the big picture. This is a generation that grew up absolutely glued to the internet and its totality of information for 2 decades now. Whose attention spans are too short to sit through fucking harry potter without checking their phone. Who go see this shit because they're bored and it's mainstream, stupid entertainment. It's like why superhero movies are popular. They don't watch TV or get social norms from movies because they spend such little time consuming those forms of entertainment anyway. Okay, so older millenials and GenX, aka a lot of those staff I was railing about. You know what. Now it all makes sense to me. You're right. My teachers growing up were those authoritarians. Maybe they got fucked by Harry Potter because I read the books when I was like 10. But they really got fucked by Columbine. And the politics of fear. And when the world gets crazier and crazier and suddenly the internet and smartphones pop out of nowhere and adolescents go crazy with it you reach for the simplest solution. Total control. Which is increasingly becoming the arm of the criminal justice system. My school had 8 girls get arrested for bullying. That was never proved in court. That's what the stakes were for my generation. Have beef with someone and the teacher will find out and you'll go to jail. But people have been doing that shit forever. It's lame mainstream tastes from people who aren't rebels but if it wasn't Harry it'd be some other family friendly kill the bad guys type moron. These are all 30 something neckbeards in these bands, not even kids or 20 something losers like myself. I had done all kinds of crazy shit leading up to this. I had gotten suspended for hacking, I had broken into the teacher's lounge, I was exchanging drugs (they didn't find out about that one though). I nearly got the cops called on me because they lent me the teacher's keys and I couldn't give it back right away bcuz the dude was on stage playing piano. I still had really good grades. They didn't march for me but some kids decided to pull one last prank at the end of the year as revenge. Because me being shot down was just one symptom of the overall climate of repression. Nobody cared the school was falling apart, or there was no toilet paper, or the teachers were being dicks. Rampant sexism. The VP had a meeting in the resource room with all the black kids. When you're 16, 17 you often can't mount a sophisticated defence. You usually just act out, like you mentioned. And "adults" aren't going to love you in the paper. They're going to villify you as a stupid teenager even if you're totally correct. I applaud Greta for being so fucking composed because I would have lost my shit. And please remember that climate protests are often school sanctioned. Walking out because your school is dehumanizing you in 17 different ways? Gonna need an HK demand sheet for that shit Those kids got expelled. The teachers locked the rioting students in the atrium. Forcible confinement, literally. One kid got arrested. And then the year ended, no newspaper ever found out or cared. A walkout for me would have been great but their attitude would have been "how do we regain control as fast as possible" and in your case that was laying off discipline. In my case? I had to fake a suicide attempt to avoid getting suspended a second time. I would have expelled for "inciting a riot" or some shit. "Misbehaviour". Like Little Pump. Because I was already the "bad guy." They would have literally called the police. There would be truancy officers. It would have been a nightmare. And you still need to get your diploma and go to college and get your nice job or whatever. I backed down and tried to be the Buddhist at the last minute but HOLY HELL DUDE I should have taken your advice and burned that shit to the fuckin' ground. What you mentioned that resonated was adults going crazy. But fuck if Harry is screwing up kids. If he screwed up the generation that taught me than he did it to the 30+ crowd. I manage a store because I'm a loser but when some sixteen year old girl tells me a story of her outrunning 6 uniformed police officers at a party with underage drinking I'm happy. I'm happy that there's still love in the world. I can't say it, because that's fucked, and that's irresponsible, and yada yada yada but I'm happy. And she's definitely seen those boogie fucks on the Suite Life on Deck. And Harry Potter. And iCarly. And all that horrible shit. Now I gotta re-read it because it's been a minute.Again, you are denying the gradient: GTA didn't cause kids to go on a murder spree therefore pop culture is utterly without influence on children.
but a culture that has identified Harry Potter as a "punk rock" rebel
Take your student council example. What would have happened if your fellow students stuck up for you? What would have happened if they collectively walked out? What would have happened if they made themselves ungovernable?
"Whelp, guess I gotta burn my sneakers now. Sucks. I really like 'em." - My 29-year-old roommate who does whatever Twitter tells him to It's been interesting watching you morph from the criminal to the victim in your head. Yeah. That's exactly what I'm talking about. Between Harry Potter the first book and Harry Potter the first movie, Columbine and September 11 happened. By Harry Potter the book I was designing cybernetic implants and mixing industrial bands to pay for college. By Harry Potter the movie I was a fuckin' architectural consultant. I was hatched. My little second cousin who does nothing but pot in Reno? He was three years old. If you were ten in '97 you graduated a year or two before the Great Recession. You are the millennial crushed in the maw of the new economy and by now you're just getting used to the fact that you'll never truly be able to afford a house. Your teenage years were the ones where bullying was that thing that got the cops involved. If you hot-dropped out of college into teaching high school you are the embodiment of overprotective authoritarianism and those neckbeards in the Harry Potter bands? They're the perpetual fandom that has convinced themselves that it's somehow okay for a 30-year-old man to be into Evangelion. Not everyone, of course. It's never everyone. But it's enough: why the fuck are people driving around with Deceptacon stickers on their cars? What the Actual Fuck? Back when you could still reasonably watch actual Deceptacons on TV in 6th grade, you'd get your fucking lights punched out for mentioning them in 7th. Now? Now we measure our tenuous cultural allegiances by whether or not we wear a "Property of Hogwarts" hoodie while we jog in our Lululemons. Here's what I'm saying: shit changed, yo, and Harry Potter is a part of that. Not the only part, not the most important part. But what you make your dreams out of influences how you live your life. But if you're ten when Katniss Everdeen comes on the scene? You're 21. You've learned that governments exist to be overthrown. You've been backed into a corner your whole life, discounted in everything you do and treated as a problem by a generation that doesn't know how to fucking live. One of the many, many poignant aspects of going to school with a bunch of surly Running Start kids in my mid '40s was hearing a 17-year-old mutter "goddamn millennials" under his breath while talking about his instructor. I did a spit take and he said "what? They're indecisive, they're always on their fucking phones and they have no idea how to get anything done because they're so wishy-washy!" He's gonna be fine - he's programming CNC punches for $80k a year after 2 years of school. His instructor? Begging for $29k with an MFA in teaching. You - you're conflating a couple things. Yes by all means you're a rebel and being a rebel is tough. But you're also a hooligan. Hooligans do not get the concessions that rebels do. After I declared myself the Antichrist I had a family court judge release one of my younger friends into my custody because he was in jail for beating his mom. I was definitely one of the surlier kids in school but I committed no petty crime that would give them an excuse to treat me as a hooligan. Hooligans lose. Always. Petty criminals never get the respect or leeway that prisoners of conscience do. Me disagreeing about the authority of the vice principal over my freedom of expression? That's a political discussion. You breaking into the teacher's lounge? Hooliganism. Try being a rebel for a while without being a hooligan. 
I can see why you're pissed off klein, but at the end of the day it's just a stupid fucking book about wizards. You can criticize it, but to blame it for any kind of broader social changes is crazy talk. And holy wack dude! I was ready to hop right on that generational gap wisdom which is why I bothered vomiting personal experience in the first place but I think it's just you. Once you mentioned that 17-y/o in your class hating on millenials. It's not Gen-Z being different because they experience the fucking Hunger Games. It's because you're in CNC class with the fucking pickup truck guys who hate the art kids and libtards. And they're gonna be automated in a few years anyway. I feel like you know this. I sense you're too narrowly focused. Which is why this is turning into what it is. I sense you see the Hogwarts sweater as "just another stupid thing" people are doing but you can drive yourself crazy over other people's bad taste. You're reading waay too much into it. I'm guilty of this too. My friends say "you overanalyze everything." Career direction -> hogwarts? Communist Party? Abstract art? I'm neither a rebel nor a hooligan. I want you to re-read that article you linked; it applies to you more than it applies to me. Cause I'm an apostrophe. I'm just a symbol to remind you that there's more to see. Here's what I'm saying: shit changed, yo, and Harry Potter is a part of that. Not the only part, not the most important part. But what you make your dreams out of influences how you live your life.
Yes by all means you're a rebel and being a rebel is tough. But you're also a hooligan. Hooligans do not get the concessions that rebels do.
Was listening to a conversation (podcast, so I won't bother you with the details) where they disscussed the idea that Gen Z-ers are the first generation to completely abandon the idea of an objective truth, a deconstruction that started after the boomers. That it's all about which ideas are useful, more than which ideas are true, and that Millennials are the last generation to still cling to the idea of some model of the world that'll make sense. I don't know if that's accurate but I found it an interesting thought to entertain nonetheless.One of the many, many poignant aspects of going to school with a bunch of surly Running Start kids in my mid '40s was hearing a 17-year-old mutter "goddamn millennials" under his breath while talking about his instructor. I did a spit take and he said "what? They're indecisive, they're always on their fucking phones and they have no idea how to get anything done because they're so wishy-washy!"
"Live my truth" is a phrase I heard a lot this summer, constantly on the lips of 20-somethings who had been caught in lies or who had found their beliefs of events to be unquestionably incorrect. Ann (to Bob): Carrie says you called her a gutterslut. Bob: I would never say something like that. Dave: I mean, I was there, Bob. you totally called Carrie a gutterslut. Bob: Look, it is what it is. Carrie can believe that but all I can do is live my truth. This works for Bob - he doesn't have to acknowledge being caught in a lie, and he doesn't have to acknowledge that he has spoken ill of others that he is pretending to like. It does not work for Carrie - she's been called a gutterslut and Bob won't own up to it. The problem is, it doesn't resolve the problems Ann and Dave have because when they're with Bob, they're subscribing to Bob's truth. When they're with Carrie, they rely on the ethos of Bob vs. the ethos of Carrie. What's interesting is that the dynamic plays out with people who are willing to subscribe to the same shared hallucination about truth. In a direct confrontation, Carrie and Bob have to battle out who said what when and where and hope they can convince Ann and Dave as to their version of events. What's noteworthy is that these exchanges took place under the watchful eye of dozens of cameras as everything being said was streamed worldwide to the Internet in real time. Objective truth was not a construct - it was a constellation of media files reviewable by all. Nonetheless, there was a collective assent to honor the fiction that there was no objective truth. "Live my truth" was interchangeable with "live my best truth". A couple times I heard the phrase "the actual truth" as if every now and then, everyone had to acknowledge the game they were playing and the fact that there are verifiable facts in the universe but the more self-centered among our victims were generally dismissive of this verification. I think it's a comfortable fiction. By subscribing to the same reality, we have affinity despite the fact that we don't really know how to communicate anymore. It runs into dire difficulty when interacting with someone outside of that collective fiction. "You're late." "If you look at it from the perspective of the traffic I had to deal with and the condition of my car, I'm about as close to on time as anyone could reasonably expect." "You're fired." It's another example where those whose worlds have been bent to suit them are utterly and completely shit outta luck when they interface with the world at large.
It's more the breakdown of previously held social norms. It's not invalidating the law of gravity, it's accepting that what colour it's acceptable to dye your hair is not based in scientific truth. "Objective truth" as it pertains to social philosophy has never really existed. And pre-Socratic skeptics thought it was impossible to know anything to begin with. The idea is hardly new. Rather there is an entire slew of right-wing commentators who are conflating "breakdown of objective truth" with "breakdown of my ideology."
Maybe by people who understand the bounds of science and evidence. I have personally seen it used in the spirit of "I reject your reality and substitute my own" without the self-aware irony.It's not invalidating the law of gravity, it's accepting that what colour it's acceptable to dye your hair is not based in scientific truth.
Well that always sucks. But in the current political situation, people are claiming transgender people are invalidating "objective truth" about reality. They're not talking about science, they're talking about the fact they grew up in a world where a boy was a boy and a girl was a girl and therefore objective truth is somehow breaking down. It's not. They mean "objective truth" in the same way the king being the divine representative of God on Earth was "objective truth." I say a trans woman is a woman and my father says climate change is fake. I'm a bit more objective I think.
It's interesting: from your perspective, the concern is people clinging to the phrase "objective truth" to mean "tradition" and that anything that threatens tradition is a fundamental threat to reality. From my perspective, the concern is people rejecting the existence of an "objective truth" as something that oppresses their wants and needs. I'll bet your father believes in the greenhouse effect. He probably even believes in greenhouse gasses. Show him a picture of Antarctica with a pink blob over it and he'll know immediately he's looking at a hole in the ozone layer. The pieces are there, it's the ideology that ties it all together that he rejects. It's hard. My earliest memories of educational television include Mr. Wizard warning us of the impending new ice age. Weekly Reader was all about how acid rain was going to destroy all structures by 1990 and we'd all need to wear SPF1000 sunscreen outside of our silvered biodomes because gamma rays would have sunburned all living matter to death but it would only matter a little because by the year 2100 Venus would be a more hospitable climate than Van Nuys. The population explosion would lead to widespread famine by the early '90s and there would be no petroleum available by the year 2000 because we would hit peak oil by 1978. This, of course, is assuming that we wouldn't die in a nuclear holocaust brought on by the Contras. So I can see how someone could retreat into a belief that climate change is fake. This is probably the reason so many discussions of climate change have been so pedantic for so long: any consumer of media has seen so many nightmare scenarios that they don't bother sleeping anymore. And when we discuss "climate change" we're talking about a constellation of observations that lead to a damning conclusion. If you accept that damning conclusion the constellation makes sense. If you don't they're isolated incidents that you explain away as irrelevant. "Sex" and "gender", on the other hand, have not been widely acknowledged as individual concepts for long at all, at least not in the mainstream. Not only that, straight white males are invariably wrong in these discussions and generally subjected to ridicule. Someone expressing an "objective truth" about cisgender women is someone refusing to use the word "cisgender" because they've never had to before and no one has ever made them feel bad about it. In both cases, the party in question is saying "I'm not going to argue about this" (because it hurts my head). They're asserting that the argument is invalid because the subject is beyond argumentation. The problem is it's being conflated from the philosophical (what is girl if not female) to the practical (I paid you back the $20 I borrowed because I feel like I don't owe it to you anymore).
Certainly. Veen mentioned podcasts so my brain immediately thought "big intellectuals" trying to claim their normative beliefs are objective reality. It's become a trope in popular media. Charles Murray thought his studies were "objective truth." Jordan Peterson tried to come up with his own definition of "truth" to justify why his beliefs were correct. It didn't make sense, but apparently society will collapse without metaphorical, objective "truth" that apparently goes beyond science. https://www.amazon.ca/Nihilism-Root-Revolution-Modern-Age/dp/1887904069 That's the fucking king of Truth right there. Priest made me read that when I was 14. That dude legitimately argues that objective truth comes from God, that medieval peasants were happier because they knew exactly where they were. And once Nietzsche said God is Dead, Truth was Dead and now the world is chaos. There is certainly an urge people have to try and see the world as more logical and objective than it is. He says "oh, the climate has always been changing." I'm not really sure what to make of that. He seems to think whatever humans are doing is having next to no impact - if the Earth is getting hotter it was just as inevitable as the end of the last Ice Age. That human greenhouse gas emissions aren't responsible for anything. I think he's just wrapping his head around what's easy. Banning CFC's? Easy. Stopping emissions? Hard, and detrimental to conservative politics. Almost certainly. But my issue comes from outright denial rather than people saying "oh, it's not that bad" or "we'll get through this" or "doomsday scenarios are overblown and repeated to death." He might believe in the greenhouse effect, but he doesn't think it's doing anything. That just doesn't make sense. These people can't just say "it's not that bad," they have to actively deny the basic mechanism. It depends who you're arguing with. Nailing someone to the cross because they didn't use the word "cisgender" is ridiculous and I would call them ridiculous. I would never discount someone's opinion because they're a straight white man. But these people are outright trying to claim that calling someone a "boy" means their sex (not gender) is male, period. That's objective. We can have an argument whether it's reasonable for people to think that or if we should change language or introduce the concept of gender as separate from sex but regardless, calling something a "boy" is just a decision people made. It's not reality. It's not objective. It's a social convention. There are languages without gendered pronouns and there are languages like French where there are masculine and feminine words. So that's where the deconstruction happens. You have sex, and then you have language where nouns can have genders. And those are associated with all kinds of stereotypes. Ben Shapiro thinks it's objective. So I'm coming at it from politics. People telling lies at your workplace? Fuck 'em. edit: and the practical aspect, the lying, I don't think is increasing under gen Z. Shittiness moves through all ages I think.From my perspective, the concern is people rejecting the existence of an "objective truth" as something that oppresses their wants and needs.
I'll bet your father believes in the greenhouse effect. He probably even believes in greenhouse gasses. Show him a picture of Antarctica with a pink blob over it and he'll know immediately he's looking at a hole in the ozone layer. The pieces are there, it's the ideology that ties it all together that he rejects.
This is probably the reason so many discussions of climate change have been so pedantic for so long: any consumer of media has seen so many nightmare scenarios that they don't bother sleeping anymore.
"Sex" and "gender", on the other hand, have not been widely acknowledged as individual concepts for long at all, at least not in the mainstream. Not only that, straight white males are invariably wrong in these discussions and generally subjected to ridicule. Someone expressing an "objective truth" about cisgender women is someone refusing to use the word "cisgender" because they've never had to before and no one has ever made them feel bad about it.
This deserves a longer response than I can give it because I had to stand up to a judge today and then do construction for five hours and I'm tired. I'll say this: "cognitive dissonance" didn't used to mean "being stupid." It used to mean "the mental discomfort and physical pain of holding two competing ideas at once." Clinically speaking, it's something we all try to avoid. We will believe a falsehood over a truth if that falsehood prevents cognitive dissonance. SO: global warming is a lie because it's been a lie all these years and all the data we see is just more noise that will eventually get disproven. The alternative is me and everyone I know are contributing to the destruction of the planet and there's no way out unless we align with all those people who have been calling us monsters lo these many years. Ever met an ex-mormon? They go through this phase where they're dead inside. Mormonism is keenly inclusive and insular; this makes it easy to align with others who believe as you do and difficult to develop a large group of friends outside your religion. It also means that when you've had enough and can no longer swallow the party line, you are lost. Your whole world is has been lost. You've been cast out. And everyone who aligns with a political movement risks this whenever their core beliefs are challenged. And we're all guilty. We're here arguing about objective truths and you can assert that criticism for not using the word "cisgender" is ridiculous but I mean, that's my reality. My wife got my daughter a doll when she was a baby. Same hair color, same eye color. My daughter outgrew it. So my wife brought it to the birth center (which she owns). And told this story about how she wanted her daughter to relate to this doll so she got her with the same hair color, same eye color. And still got an eyeroll. Because my daughter has blonde hair and blue eyes. So this doll? It's fuckin' evil. What's happening is the people who think my daughter shouldn't play with blue-eyed dolls are in a pissing match with the people who think that "boy" means "male" because the future has yet to be decided. I just wish we could do it without ripping each other to shreds. Except Ben Shapiro. I'd totally rip that fucker to shreds. I don't think the lying is increasing under genZ. It was surprising to me, however, to see the rhetorical instrument "it's not a lie if truth is subjective" employed. Over. And over.