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comment by sounds_sound
sounds_sound  ·  4612 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Grrrrrrrrrrr
It's a bit disconcerting to me that future decisions on the functionality of Hubski are informed by how to deal with people like tarekzombie. I've seen this dude come up in many conversations recently and they're all about how to ignore him in as many ways as possible. If you check out his page and look through the history of his postings, you'll notice that there has not been one single share or comment - except for one. I commented on his very first post because, even on his first day on the site, he appeared to be a potential spammer and I wanted to at least engage him. Well that went nowhere and I can't say I appreciate it. At what point can you safely say, well there's 100 people ignoring this dude, maybe the Hubski community would be better off without this person? It's a challenging question, and I understand that Hubski doesn't want to start policing the site this way. I guess it comes down to this one question:

Is there a minimum standard the members of Hubski be held to?





caio  ·  4611 days ago  ·  link  ·  
I think tarekezombie has been shouted out plenty a-time to. Were he not a bot, I think he might've already come forward. The thing is, though, he's still there posting. The admin hasn't banned him and he can continue to post the same things he's posting right now. The decision to see it (through the external posts button and the ignore button) or share it lies, I think, entirely to the users. So, when thenewgreen asks:

    at what point to we say "this person is a spammer"?

The great thing, I think, is we can decide that for our personal feeds individually, without the need of a disclaimer like "spamming will not be allowed" in the about page. The site provides the option for us to say "spam is what we make of it."

* * *

riemannman's question about hate speech is, I think, a harder one. Admin had to deal with inappropriate content before. I think it's a more legal territory than anything else. Doesn't the US -- btw, I'm not a US citizen -- has laws against discrimination? If someone is posting hate speech, isn't the best solution to flag them?

tarekezombie  ·  4610 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Man what is this ! what I done wrong ? why is all this mess ? I thought this is a free space where people can post as much as they could like StumbleUpon for example.... why are you making such a big deal out of it ! I am not a spammer and I don't even know what that exactly means and as far as I know I didn't harm any one ,,,, if the admins tell me to stop posting I will leave this website but until then no one has the right to tell me what to do. Thank you.
mk  ·  4610 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Hey there you are! No worries tarekezombie, you aren't going to be banned. Quite a few folk are ignoring your posts, however, so you might consider mixing it up a bit.

But, that's up to you.

mk  ·  4610 days ago  ·  link  ·  
    The great thing, I think, is we can decide that for our personal feeds individually, without the need of a disclaimer like "spamming will not be allowed" in the about page. The site provides the option for us to say "spam is what we make of it."

That's my goal.

However, I am going to get a bit involved if spammy users are getting in the way of content discovery. I don't want to get into the business of playing whack-a-mole with spammers. But, if a user is ignored by a large number of people, they might not have an equal presence in the external posts feed. For those of us that have been around, we've been able to ignore these users as they have come, however, for new Hubskiers, their presence could be a nuisance and really impede discovery of good content.

For that reason, at some point I'll probably leverage the ignoring of the current user base, and make a large 'ignored by' count cause posts to more quickly fall through the external post feed.

b_b  ·  4611 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Ah caio, if only everyone got it as well as you...sigh, what a wonderful world it would be.

As to your question about hate speech. The only type of speech that is banned in the US is specific threats against people and inciting violence. I can say, "I hate hubskiers, and I wish someone would kill them." But I can't say, "I hate thenewgreen, and I'm going to kill him." There are no laws against any type of racist, offensive or violent speech that doesn't make a serious threat to anyone in particular like you might find in many European countries (like for example their laws against Holocaust denial). Free speech is one of the holiest things here.

What is it like in Brazil? What type of things are permissible there?

caio  ·  4611 days ago  ·  link  ·  
This is actually kind of embarrassing, but I had to go the Wiki to check this.

Brazil has anti-discrimination laws which prohibits discrimination against Age, Race, Color, National origin, Disability, Religion, Sex, Marital status, Political affiliation, Pregnancy, Citizenship. Note that sexual orientation is not in there. It's funny we're having this discussion right now, because earlier today, I saw a video on YT about a congresswoman, a catholic missionary, who was voting against a bill to include sexual orientation. The bill, I'm sad to say, didn't pass.

I'd have to check it, but my feelings are that you couldn't hold the "Death to all Hubskiers" flag here. There's a lot of violence, both physical and verbal, towards all kinds of minorities: black people, poor people, women, indians, but I'm tempted to say that's more of a concealed, though not isolated, occurence.

So, in general, I'd say racism -- all kinds of -isms -- is frowned upon, it's illegal, but it still happens.

EDIT: Oh, my, I just remembered! The other day, this guy was arrested for publishing discriminatory content on the web. He'll be charged for racial prejudice and pedophilia.

thenewgreen  ·  4611 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Take it Easy.
tarekezombie  ·  4610 days ago  ·  link  ·  
This comment has been deleted.
tarekezombie  ·  4610 days ago  ·  link  ·  
This comment has been deleted.
thenewgreen  ·  4611 days ago  ·  link  ·  
Well said, I don't think mk wants to be in the policing business. It's the intent of the site to allow the users to tailor their experience and decide, who is and is not a spammer. Like you said, "spam is what we make of it". I agree
riemannman  ·  4612 days ago  ·  link  ·  
I was thinking about that too. Is it healthy that hubski is taking these issues on a case by case basis? I would suppose so... for now. Only because of how small a community this is at the moment. But there are bigger issues that lay down the road for hubski if the site expands. How will hubski deal with hate speech? What happens if a large portion of the user base starts to use hubski as a cat-pic/rage comic exchange? Are these questions that need answers now, or ones that mk and others will deal with later?
dublinben  ·  4612 days ago  ·  link  ·  
I think the cat pictures/rage comic invasion isn't really much of a problem. I doubt that many of the users responsible for that kind of content are the same users that post the kinds of things you're interested in. It shouldn't be too difficult to let both kinds of content thrive on the site, with neither interfering with the other.
thenewgreen  ·  4612 days ago  ·  link  ·  
I agree with you, I haven't even noticed tarekzombies posts since I've ignored their account. I think that's the virtue of Hubski, a community of rage comic lovers and a community of particle physics enthusiasts can both exist and never cross paths. That said, sounds_sound raises an interesting question, at what point to we say "this person is a spammer"? There's some gray there. How do you define this? These are tough and fascinating questions.