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JTHipster  ·  4234 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Monoprice and the One True Anti-Apple

    Environmentalism isn't a luxury, it's an imperative. The fact that you've managed to justify your exemption from it because the people you buy from aren't making you think about it isn't a sign of your wisdom, it's a sign of your selfishness.

I'll start with this first.

We are not in disagreement that environmentalism is necessary. It is. I like the ability to survive on a planet without drastic environmental changes, I like not seeing trash on the streets and I like getting good gas mileage. Those are all very nice. They are practically more expensive than most people can afford to pay, because most of the environmentally friendly items are new.

Things will probably change in 10 years when the first and second generation of eco products makes its way on to the secondary market, but right now if you want a solar panel or a hybrid car that's not new you're going to have a harder time finding it for less than a regular car. When's the last time you passed a Prius on sale for under $4000? Maybe 3 months ago, maybe 4, our neighbors offered us an SUV, some white Ford or something for ~$4,000. 80,000 miles, good condition, they just didn't want it and knew it wasn't going to make it at the dealers, not anymore. Cheapest Prius near me? $4,500, 200,000 miles. More expensive, more likely to break. Not worth it (we didn't go for the SUV either).

Otherwise the prices quickly hit $10,000. Here's the crux of the problem: Why would I buy a $10,000 car that's better for the environment when I can get something that's worse, but cheaper for me by a whole lot?

The mouse is ultimately irrelevant at this point; its a mouse, if you're at the income level where you can't afford a gaming mouse you just don't buy it. A regular mouse is just fine; if you spend $100 on a gaming mouse when you can't afford groceries then there is something wrong with your priorities anyway. Same with buying a gaming mouse for $13.97.

Other things you can't really avoid, things like food or clothes, furniture, utilities. When you get to IKEA and you see that table for $20, you know that the product you are getting is worth $20. It will last a couple of years, maybe longer if you are careful. It will last much less time than a much nicer table, like Oak Barn, but in the moment that difference is irrelevant.

I think what's happening here, and what I have a problem with, is that you seem to be assigning blame in reverse. Customers very rarely go out of their way to shut down a business. They just buy whatever they think is going to be the best for its price, however they judge "best." Looking at them and going "man fuck these people for buying the cheaply made products with mediocre quality" is like blaming someone for taking a shit. Its unpleasant to smell, but its the job of the toilet to mitigate the reek of ass.

People are always going to try and live well, and if they find they can have a higher standard of living by buying cheaper goods they are going to do exactly that. Going back to the speakers for a moment, its like blaming the indie bands for not buying the Mackie 1202 when the Alesis is half the price. Of course they're going to buy it: its half the price and more than half the quality.

I'm doing a few other things while typing so excuse how scatterbrained this post is getting, but I have to emphasize that the quality gained for the price does not match. The IKEA desk might be $20, but it is a functional desk. It's 1/5th the price of the Oak Barn even if its only half as well made. Same with the mouse. Same with the keyboard. Same with the food. Same with my speakers. Same with my monitor.

They're cheaper than their quality. My desk is actually pretty nice, but if I had to choose between buying it at even used price for $100 or buying a $20 IKEA desk, I will choose the IKEA. When I start making actual money, I will buy the nice desk and the organic food.

I think part of this argument is us angrily agreeing with each other.